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Anon
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Camshaft thrust sprocket

Hi,

I changed the head gasket today on my 1986 Bedford CF2 (2.0T Petrol engine). On reassembly, the plastic "camshaft thrust sprocket" broke off. Are these obtainable from anywhere now? And also, would it run without one? The camshaft endfloat would be way out!

Thanks,

Stu

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Sun 20 Sep 2015 @ 18:52 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Hi stuvaux,

Running the engine without a thrust would allow the camshaft to float and cause damage to the valves and could allow the timing gears to run out of line.
This engine was also used in the Opel Manta as well as the Vauxhall Cavilier, still a few of them around.

doujoy

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Sun 20 Sep 2015 @ 20:49 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Mr D.S.Joyce. wrote:
Hi stuvaux,

Running the engine without a thrust would allow the camshaft to float and cause damage to the valves and could allow the timing gears to run out of line.
This engine was also used in the Opel Manta as well as the Vauxhall Cavilier, still a few of them around.

doujoy


Thanks, I will take a look and see what I can find


Sun 20 Sep 2015 @ 21:16 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Hi,

I have had no luck at all trying to track down a camshaft thrust sprocket. Would it be okay to fit a similar sized metal bolt that allows the same amount of endfloat? Or is this unsuitable?

Thanks

Mon 21 Sep 2015 @ 19:52 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Any ideas on the metal bolt replacing the camshaft thrust sprocket? I really need to get the van running by tomorrow....

Thanks

Tue 22 Sep 2015 @ 11:02 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Thrust washer.

Hi stuvaux.

You must make very sure that this bolt controls any end float on the camshaft and therefore stops the cam-followers and timing gears from moving out of line, and at the same time it does not cause any damage to casings or sprockets.
Any damage at road speed would be very catastrophic and could reck the engine.

doujoy

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Tue 22 Sep 2015 @ 13:10 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Mr D.S.Joyce. wrote:
Hi stuvaux.

You must make very sure that this bolt controls any end float on the camshaft and therefore stops the cam-followers and timing gears from moving out of line, and at the same time it does not cause any damage to casings or sprockets.
Any damage at road speed would be very catastrophic and could reck the engine.

doujoy


Hi,

Many thanks for the advice. The bolt is very similar in size to the original, and I fitted a collar washer to it so that it is snug against the sprocket, in the same way as the original. I was mainly worried as it is metal rather than plastic.

The other problem I have today is that it will not start. There is a spark, but it does not seem to want to fire up....

Thanks

Stu


Tue 22 Sep 2015 @ 20:07 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Not starting.

Hi stuvaux.

I take it you are just now trying to start the engine for the first time since refitting the cylinder head, valve clearances may not be correct and if they are self adjusting oil fed cam-followers it may take a fair bit of engine turn over before they are fully primed with oil and the valves are opening fully.

doujoy

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Tue 22 Sep 2015 @ 20:33 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Mr D.S.Joyce. wrote:
Hi stuvaux.

I take it you are just now trying to start the engine for the first time since refitting the cylinder head, valve clearances may not be correct and if they are self adjusting oil fed cam-followers it may take a fair bit of engine turn over before they are fully primed with oil and the valves are opening fully.

doujoy


Hi,

Yes I am trying to start it for the first time. Thanks for the information, will give it a better try tomorrow.

Thanks,

Stu
Tue 22 Sep 2015 @ 20:46 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Hi,

Managed to start it today by bump starting. Found that the timing was out - set it back up by aligning the cut out on crank (woodruff key, pointing up) and marks on cam sprocket. Turns over fine but doesn't start. It does start when bump started, but stops running as soon as I put the clutch back in. It also makes a lot of popping noises.

Any ideas on this - and I hope I haven't managed to get the timing out by 180 degrees now! Though I would think it would turn over as if no compression, as it did before

Thanks

Stu


Wed 23 Sep 2015 @ 19:32 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Timing.

Hi stuvaux,

Sounds to me like the valve timing is still not spot on, or the distributor has been moved and is delivering the sparks too late or too early hence the popping back through valves not quite closed in time for ign spark.
This would mean starting on the key could not build up enough compression to start the engine.
If the valve clearances are set manually then make sure they are not too tight,
if self adjusting check that enough oil supply is reaching them and they are fully primed.
If all seems ok the next step would have to be;-

In the your position I would be going back to basic's with the cam-box cover off and the spark plugs out, turning the engine to TDC one then checking that both valves on number one cylinder were closed with the cam-shaft lobs pointing upwards and with a thin screw driver make sure that the number piston is at the very top of the cylinder.
Then check the woodruff key was at TDC then check timing marks on the cam-shaft sprocket are in line, if not correct as need be.

doujoy

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Wed 23 Sep 2015 @ 20:25 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Mr D.S.Joyce. wrote:
Hi stuvaux,

Sounds to me like the valve timing is still not spot on, or the distributor has been moved and is delivering the sparks too late or too early hence the popping back through valves not quite closed in time for ign spark.
This would mean starting on the key could not build up enough compression to start the engine.
If the valve clearances are set manually then make sure they are not too tight,
if self adjusting check that enough oil supply is reaching them and they are fully primed.
If all seems ok the next step would have to be;-

In the your position I would be going back to basic's with the cam-box cover off and the spark plugs out, turning the engine to TDC one then checking that both valves on number one cylinder were closed with the cam-shaft lobs pointing upwards and with a thin screw driver make sure that the number piston is at the very top of the cylinder.
Then check the woodruff key was at TDC then check timing marks on the cam-shaft sprocket are in line, if not correct as need be.

doujoy


Hi,

Thanks for that detailed description. I will do all that tomorrow, and hopefully it will be sorted. Thanks again for the advice, really appreciated.

Stu

Wed 23 Sep 2015 @ 21:02 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Timing.

Hi stuvaux,

This is something you have to take your time with and make sure you have got it just right, mark your timing points with tipex that is what I use and it stays there for all time making it a lot easier to get everything lined up.
And if something does move you can spot it easily, once you are set up turn the engine by hand at least four complete runs and then check your tipex marks still line up.

doujoy

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Thu 24 Sep 2015 @ 09:35 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
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Mr D.S.Joyce. wrote:
Hi stuvaux,

This is something you have to take your time with and make sure you have got it just right, mark your timing points with tipex that is what I use and it stays there for all time making it a lot easier to get everything lined up.
And if something does move you can spot it easily, once you are set up turn the engine by hand at least four complete runs and then check your tipex marks still line up.

doujoy


That's great advice, thanks. Going to go through everything again now. I think it is almost there now.

Thu 24 Sep 2015 @ 10:49 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Which engine.

Hi stuvaux,

You have not said which engine your CF has if it is the 2.0T with manually adjustable valve clearances you should look for a timing mark on the flywheel which sets number four cylinder on compression stroke at 5* BEFORE TDC.
If this is the engine you have using the woodruff key at the bottom pulley will set the cam-shaft 180* out.

doujoy

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Thu 24 Sep 2015 @ 14:59 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Mr D.S.Joyce. wrote:
Hi stuvaux,

You have not said which engine your CF has if it is the 2.0T with manually adjustable valve clearances you should look for a timing mark on the flywheel which sets number four cylinder on compression stroke at 5* BEFORE TDC.
If this is the engine you have using the woodruff key at the bottom pulley will set the cam-shaft 180* out.

doujoy


Hi,

Yes it does have the 2.0T engine. There are 2 cut outs on the flywheel, and a mark on the housing. Are these supposed to match up when the cam sprockets marks match? Very confusing, as the Haynes manual says to match the woodruff key pointing straight up and the cam sprocket marks.

Just trying to upload a picture of the flywheel marks

Thu 24 Sep 2015 @ 15:25 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Here is the pic of flywheel marks:



As you can see, one flywheel cutout is lined up in the pic, but there is another one about an inch away from that one.

Thu 24 Sep 2015 @ 15:39 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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It is frustrating as it almost fires up but will not quite start....the timing surely cant be that far out. Sounds way better now when turning over....before I aligned the timing it sounded like there was no compression at all. I'm sure that was when the flywheel timing mark was aligned with the mark in the housing

Thu 24 Sep 2015 @ 18:13 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Timing.

Hi stuvaux,

That picture is showing the front end bottom pulley not the flywheel, if you shine a light at the back of the engine if I mind correctly on the exhaust side of the engine you should be able to see a hole in the block casting where you can see a small pointer, if you turn the engine very slowly you should find a small steel ball set into in the flywheel.
Line up the steel ball with the pointer on the block and that should give you TDC on compression stroke at number four cylinder, just below that steel ball on the flywheel is a five degree before TDC mark, once you have got them in line reset your valve timing at the cam-shaft sprocket.
I take it that this engine is in-fact the 2.0T model with manually adjusted valve clearances?

doujoy

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Thu 24 Sep 2015 @ 19:50 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
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Mr D.S.Joyce. wrote:
Hi stuvaux,

That picture is showing the front end bottom pulley not the flywheel, if you shine a light at the back of the engine if I mind correctly on the exhaust side of the engine you should be able to see a hole in the block casting where you can see a small pointer, if you turn the engine very slowly you should find a small steel ball set into in the flywheel.
Line up the steel ball with the pointer on the block and that should give you TDC on compression stroke at number four cylinder, just below that steel ball on the flywheel is a five degree before TDC mark, once you have got them in line reset your valve timing at the cam-shaft sprocket.
I take it that this engine is in-fact the 2.0T model with manually adjusted valve clearances?

doujoy


Hi doujoy,

Thank you for explaining that so well. I have seen pics of where the timing marks are supposed to be, now I should be able to actually find them!

So is it the five degree before TDC mark I line up and then reset the valve timing at cam sprocket?

And yes, the engine is the 2.0T with manually adjusted valve clearances.

Thanks

Stu

Thu 24 Sep 2015 @ 20:09 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
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